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	<title>Comments on: Same-Sex Marriage? Sure! Why Not?</title>
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		<title>By: kassie</title>
		<link>http://lambofgodnj.org/blogs/esther/states-of-life/same-sex-marriage-sure-why-not/comment-page-1/#comment-310</link>
		<dc:creator>kassie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2009 14:07:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lambofgodnj.org/blogs/esther/?p=203#comment-310</guid>
		<description>vesper, thank you for that thoughtful response. i&#039;m sorry for taking forever to respond again- i forgot for awhile to re-check the blog and then have been thinking about it. i do think that approaching the issue from a purely biblical perspective and from a more civil/practical perspective are different things. for me, the biblical part is pretty clear, but it&#039;s the practical part that i&#039;m thinking about. i absolutely agree that we should be living in a way that brings God&#039;s kingdom to earth and that we should be taking action in addition to praying. and i definitely wasn&#039;t suggesting that we should hide our convictions. of course, the holy spirit convicts through the truth in the word. it&#039;s amazing how God spoke to you and called you through his commands to holiness. i do think that homosexuality and believing in reincarnation are a little different though, since historically, the church has been so condemning and judgemental of gays and built up walls, so that often gay people do not feel welcome in churches. in a lot of cases, i think that gay people know what the bible says about their lifestyle, but as a result, see God as an angry vicious god wanting to destroy them for their sin rather than as a loving father whose heart is grieved by their lifestyle and longs to bring them into wholeness and a relationship with him. so of course we shouldn&#039;t pedal around the issue of the sin, just because its uncomfortable, but still, in this case, because of the historical hatred from &quot;christians&quot; attached to it, i think the emphasis should be on love. for any of us, we only desire to flee from sin as we get closer to God, we are humbled as we stand in his presence and we choose to obey his commandments because we know and love him. love is the only thing that can break down the barriers. and when the barriers are broken down, people are more able to recognize the truth since it becomes less dirtied by the hurt caused by hateful &quot;christians.&quot; 

in terms of political action, i guess i don&#039;t see what the purpose of trying to make same sex marriage illegal would be. our government is not a christian nation and aims to respect all religions and faiths (and lack of religion/anti-religion). so though we believe same-sex marriage is not God&#039;s plan for his people, why does that mean the government should impose that on all people? when the government makes same sex marriage illegal, it doesn&#039;t make gay people suddenly convicted of their sin; it just makes them angry. but if gay people started coming to christ in large numbers and became convicted by the spirit after that or as part of their conversion or whatever, the legal argument would be less relevant. i keep thinking of the adulterous woman whom the pharisees were trying to stone and jesus just looked at with love and forgave. after looking into the eyes of jesus, i would bet that that woman never committed adultery again. campaigns to make same sex marriage illegal seem to me more like throwing judgemental stones at this community than bending down to look into their eyes and point them towards jesus. i don&#039;t think that homosexuality/abortion/poverty/etc. are different in terms of the evil they can cause or their importance to God (though it is interesting that jesus talks about riches/helping the poor a lot more than he talks about most other stuff), but i do think that they are entirely different as political issues. if the government outlaws abortion, people are still going to have abortions in  back alley ways while if the government gives money to programs to lift people out of poverty, there is only good that will come out of it. what really brings change isn&#039;t legal action, but powerful encounters with the living God.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>vesper, thank you for that thoughtful response. i&#8217;m sorry for taking forever to respond again- i forgot for awhile to re-check the blog and then have been thinking about it. i do think that approaching the issue from a purely biblical perspective and from a more civil/practical perspective are different things. for me, the biblical part is pretty clear, but it&#8217;s the practical part that i&#8217;m thinking about. i absolutely agree that we should be living in a way that brings God&#8217;s kingdom to earth and that we should be taking action in addition to praying. and i definitely wasn&#8217;t suggesting that we should hide our convictions. of course, the holy spirit convicts through the truth in the word. it&#8217;s amazing how God spoke to you and called you through his commands to holiness. i do think that homosexuality and believing in reincarnation are a little different though, since historically, the church has been so condemning and judgemental of gays and built up walls, so that often gay people do not feel welcome in churches. in a lot of cases, i think that gay people know what the bible says about their lifestyle, but as a result, see God as an angry vicious god wanting to destroy them for their sin rather than as a loving father whose heart is grieved by their lifestyle and longs to bring them into wholeness and a relationship with him. so of course we shouldn&#8217;t pedal around the issue of the sin, just because its uncomfortable, but still, in this case, because of the historical hatred from &#8220;christians&#8221; attached to it, i think the emphasis should be on love. for any of us, we only desire to flee from sin as we get closer to God, we are humbled as we stand in his presence and we choose to obey his commandments because we know and love him. love is the only thing that can break down the barriers. and when the barriers are broken down, people are more able to recognize the truth since it becomes less dirtied by the hurt caused by hateful &#8220;christians.&#8221; </p>
<p>in terms of political action, i guess i don&#8217;t see what the purpose of trying to make same sex marriage illegal would be. our government is not a christian nation and aims to respect all religions and faiths (and lack of religion/anti-religion). so though we believe same-sex marriage is not God&#8217;s plan for his people, why does that mean the government should impose that on all people? when the government makes same sex marriage illegal, it doesn&#8217;t make gay people suddenly convicted of their sin; it just makes them angry. but if gay people started coming to christ in large numbers and became convicted by the spirit after that or as part of their conversion or whatever, the legal argument would be less relevant. i keep thinking of the adulterous woman whom the pharisees were trying to stone and jesus just looked at with love and forgave. after looking into the eyes of jesus, i would bet that that woman never committed adultery again. campaigns to make same sex marriage illegal seem to me more like throwing judgemental stones at this community than bending down to look into their eyes and point them towards jesus. i don&#8217;t think that homosexuality/abortion/poverty/etc. are different in terms of the evil they can cause or their importance to God (though it is interesting that jesus talks about riches/helping the poor a lot more than he talks about most other stuff), but i do think that they are entirely different as political issues. if the government outlaws abortion, people are still going to have abortions in  back alley ways while if the government gives money to programs to lift people out of poverty, there is only good that will come out of it. what really brings change isn&#8217;t legal action, but powerful encounters with the living God.</p>
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		<title>By: Vesper</title>
		<link>http://lambofgodnj.org/blogs/esther/states-of-life/same-sex-marriage-sure-why-not/comment-page-1/#comment-307</link>
		<dc:creator>Vesper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 01:32:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lambofgodnj.org/blogs/esther/?p=203#comment-307</guid>
		<description>Kassie,
I&#039;ve been taking my time responding to you because such a thoughtful comment deserves a thoughtful response. It&#039;s obvious that your heart is to build bridges that the Gospel can freely walk across, and that is commendable. I have the same heart for evangelism--in terms of spiritual gifts it is my greatest passion. I personally move with the most comfort and ease when I am &quot;eating with sinners&quot;, so to speak. I think it&#039;s because the memory of my own salvation experience is still so fresh even after 16 years. It still baffles me that God got *me*.

I have been reflecting on my own story in light of this. When I came to the Lord, I was a practicing Wiccan, and was also fairly deeply involved in eastern mysticism. I attended a Hindu temple in NYC for the first three years of high school and had a strong spiritual hunger, and a hunger for truth in a big way. It&#039;s still a large part of my makeup, and doesn&#039;t always make for being a good diplomat. But what got me into the kingdom, frankly, wasn&#039;t anyone soft-pedaling around hot-button issues. After two solid years of my friends bugging me to go to their youth group, I capitulated, and pretty early on heard this from Galatians 5:19-21:

&lt;blockquote&gt;&quot;19The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.&quot;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Boy, right there in v 20 it says it in black and white: witchcraft. I had lived so happy and carefree as a brazen syncretist for three years, but suddenly I came under what we call &quot;the conviction of the Holy Spirit&quot;. Within 6 months I was saved--and all that time, could I have pointed to a feeling of &quot;love&quot; from the youth group? Not really--in fact, it took me many more years to actually know what that word meant or looked like. In fact, the night I got saved, it was much more about my own desperate emptiness than about love. I had no choice--I felt it was &quot;say yes to Jesus or die&quot; (my feeling, not what was communicated to me). And my newfound brethren were never wavering or apologetic about the fact that, actually, I was &lt;em&gt;*wrong*&lt;/em&gt; about reincarnation (etc., etc., etc.). I thank God! they cared enough about me to lovingly but firmly teach me the truth of the Scriptures. What a firm foundation they laid for me! Now, don&#039;t get me wrong--I know that love is what it&#039;s all about. I know that &lt;em&gt;*now*&lt;/em&gt;. But don&#039;t underestimate the power of the Word, nor of people living biblically truthful lives, to bring people into the Kingdom. Jesus Himself said that when the Holy Spirit came, He would convict the world in regards to sin, righteousness and judgment. That was true with Philip and the Ethiopian--in fact, look at the calling of all the disciples! There is something in us, and this has been my experience with my gay friends and acquaintances, that gravitates toward unapologetic conviction. Lived out in love, that&#039;s powerful. I personally feel completely comfortable having friends of all walks of life and persuasions--and being very transparent about my beliefs. I&#039;ve also been in situations (mostly with musicians that are Christians) where I was asked to &quot;cover up&quot; my true convictions for the sake of bridge-building...and I felt sleazy and dishonest.

Now, for your question about my slavery example. I believe, as I have said, that we are a post-Christian nation (if we ever were one at all; that is debatable--on another blog, not mine). Therefore, I think that it is entirely possible that we will lose whatever political effort we are engaged in on the same-sex marriage issue. Does it mean that we do not bring it into the public square for debate? No. If we really believe that Jesus has defeated &quot;the prince of the air&quot;, and that &quot;the earth is the Lord&#039;s&quot;, then we must fight social injustices. I have been troubled by groups like Sojourners, et. al. that try to downplay &quot;secondary issues&quot; in favor of serving the poor, etc. Neither same-sex marriage, abortion, nor the poor are secondary OR primary! 

When it came to abolition of slavery, many people rightly understood that it was important because it had to do with the oppression of human beings made in God&#039;s image. I ask myself often, mostly in light of the shedding of innocent blood through abortion: What side of the slavery issue would I have wanted to be on? And the answer is, I would hope that I would have been part of the Underground Railroad! Yes, and praying between &quot;guests&quot;! Praying for the fullness of God&#039;s Kingdom to come. Yes, and loving my neighbors that were slave-holders even while I gently but persistently took a stand for what was right. Yes, and going to the ballot-box and writing to my representatives. If we hold that our faith is important only in the realm of initial salvation but do not seek to contend for &quot;Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven&quot;, then what is this all for?! (I refer you to my earlier post on desiring the Second Coming.)

I don&#039;t pretend to have any ideas on this practically, other than when we see something that has not come under the Lordship of Christ, we need to use all avenues (yes, and especially prayer--you&#039;re right about that!) to plead with Jesus to &quot;make all things new&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kassie,<br />
I&#8217;ve been taking my time responding to you because such a thoughtful comment deserves a thoughtful response. It&#8217;s obvious that your heart is to build bridges that the Gospel can freely walk across, and that is commendable. I have the same heart for evangelism&#8211;in terms of spiritual gifts it is my greatest passion. I personally move with the most comfort and ease when I am &#8220;eating with sinners&#8221;, so to speak. I think it&#8217;s because the memory of my own salvation experience is still so fresh even after 16 years. It still baffles me that God got *me*.</p>
<p>I have been reflecting on my own story in light of this. When I came to the Lord, I was a practicing Wiccan, and was also fairly deeply involved in eastern mysticism. I attended a Hindu temple in NYC for the first three years of high school and had a strong spiritual hunger, and a hunger for truth in a big way. It&#8217;s still a large part of my makeup, and doesn&#8217;t always make for being a good diplomat. But what got me into the kingdom, frankly, wasn&#8217;t anyone soft-pedaling around hot-button issues. After two solid years of my friends bugging me to go to their youth group, I capitulated, and pretty early on heard this from Galatians 5:19-21:</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;19The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<p>Boy, right there in v 20 it says it in black and white: witchcraft. I had lived so happy and carefree as a brazen syncretist for three years, but suddenly I came under what we call &#8220;the conviction of the Holy Spirit&#8221;. Within 6 months I was saved&#8211;and all that time, could I have pointed to a feeling of &#8220;love&#8221; from the youth group? Not really&#8211;in fact, it took me many more years to actually know what that word meant or looked like. In fact, the night I got saved, it was much more about my own desperate emptiness than about love. I had no choice&#8211;I felt it was &#8220;say yes to Jesus or die&#8221; (my feeling, not what was communicated to me). And my newfound brethren were never wavering or apologetic about the fact that, actually, I was <em>*wrong*</em> about reincarnation (etc., etc., etc.). I thank God! they cared enough about me to lovingly but firmly teach me the truth of the Scriptures. What a firm foundation they laid for me! Now, don&#8217;t get me wrong&#8211;I know that love is what it&#8217;s all about. I know that <em>*now*</em>. But don&#8217;t underestimate the power of the Word, nor of people living biblically truthful lives, to bring people into the Kingdom. Jesus Himself said that when the Holy Spirit came, He would convict the world in regards to sin, righteousness and judgment. That was true with Philip and the Ethiopian&#8211;in fact, look at the calling of all the disciples! There is something in us, and this has been my experience with my gay friends and acquaintances, that gravitates toward unapologetic conviction. Lived out in love, that&#8217;s powerful. I personally feel completely comfortable having friends of all walks of life and persuasions&#8211;and being very transparent about my beliefs. I&#8217;ve also been in situations (mostly with musicians that are Christians) where I was asked to &#8220;cover up&#8221; my true convictions for the sake of bridge-building&#8230;and I felt sleazy and dishonest.</p>
<p>Now, for your question about my slavery example. I believe, as I have said, that we are a post-Christian nation (if we ever were one at all; that is debatable&#8211;on another blog, not mine). Therefore, I think that it is entirely possible that we will lose whatever political effort we are engaged in on the same-sex marriage issue. Does it mean that we do not bring it into the public square for debate? No. If we really believe that Jesus has defeated &#8220;the prince of the air&#8221;, and that &#8220;the earth is the Lord&#8217;s&#8221;, then we must fight social injustices. I have been troubled by groups like Sojourners, et. al. that try to downplay &#8220;secondary issues&#8221; in favor of serving the poor, etc. Neither same-sex marriage, abortion, nor the poor are secondary OR primary! </p>
<p>When it came to abolition of slavery, many people rightly understood that it was important because it had to do with the oppression of human beings made in God&#8217;s image. I ask myself often, mostly in light of the shedding of innocent blood through abortion: What side of the slavery issue would I have wanted to be on? And the answer is, I would hope that I would have been part of the Underground Railroad! Yes, and praying between &#8220;guests&#8221;! Praying for the fullness of God&#8217;s Kingdom to come. Yes, and loving my neighbors that were slave-holders even while I gently but persistently took a stand for what was right. Yes, and going to the ballot-box and writing to my representatives. If we hold that our faith is important only in the realm of initial salvation but do not seek to contend for &#8220;Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven&#8221;, then what is this all for?! (I refer you to my earlier post on desiring the Second Coming.)</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t pretend to have any ideas on this practically, other than when we see something that has not come under the Lordship of Christ, we need to use all avenues (yes, and especially prayer&#8211;you&#8217;re right about that!) to plead with Jesus to &#8220;make all things new&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Kassie Dantzler</title>
		<link>http://lambofgodnj.org/blogs/esther/states-of-life/same-sex-marriage-sure-why-not/comment-page-1/#comment-305</link>
		<dc:creator>Kassie Dantzler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Jun 2009 21:51:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lambofgodnj.org/blogs/esther/?p=203#comment-305</guid>
		<description>so i don&#039;t really disagree with anything you&#039;ve said...i definitely believe that God&#039;s plan for marriage is for a man and a woman (for the reasons given above and many more) and that He is revealed and reflected through that. the thing that i don&#039;t understand though is how a conviction that something is not the will of God has to equal fighting for a legal prohibition. you mentioned the argument of slavery in the bible, but didn&#039;t say how you respond to that. i&#039;d be interested to hear your thoughts because that&#039;s something i hear a lot. the bible doesn&#039;t say you should go and fight and overturn the institution of slavery, but rather overturns the system from the inside (or at least that&#039;s how it seems to me) by commanding not only slaves to obey their masters, but also masters to care for and love their slaves. it&#039;s being an example of God&#039;s love and kingdom of upside down justice in the midst of an unjust system. so why can&#039;t it be a similar thing with same sex marriage (or abortion, too, but i guess that&#039;s a different discussion)? why can&#039;t we respond to this by first loving people and bringing them to know God rather than condemning? openly advocating against same sex marriage is condemnation of individual people who associate their identities with their sexuality, not just of a certain sin. making same sex marriage illegal isn&#039;t going to make gay people not gay and gay people aren&#039;t going to see the example of christ when they are constantly being attacked by christian political movement. but maybe if the church makes an effort to reach out and be the hands and feet of God to this ostracized community, they will come to know Jesus and be transformed from the inside out, perhaps overturning the system in the process. i don&#039;t think that the role of the government is to propagate christian values or that loving people where they are always means total acceptance of what they do. even just thinking about the homosexual co-op on my college campus- if my christian fellowship started campaigning on campus to make same sex marriage illegal, we would NEVER be able to build relationships with the gay community- barriers would be built up immediately. but by being friends with the individuals who make up that community and being an example of love, maybe they will see Jesus. i&#039;m not saying we should dumb down the gospel or pretend like God thinks homosexuality and same-sex marriage is great. but couldn&#039;t it be possible to stand strong on scripture while also finding ways to relate to a community that has been so unfairly ostracized by christians in the past, to speak the truth in love when it comes up in conversations but not create political campaigns around it? to be clear, i&#039;m not saying that i &quot;support&quot; marriage equality, but rather that we should be living and praying for people to know Jesus in a real way instead of politically advocating against same sex marriage. if you&#039;re advocating open condemnation of same sex marriage, how is that to be done in love? how would you say the knowledge that male/female marriage reflects the image of God affect how the church should approach this issue in the public sphere?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>so i don&#8217;t really disagree with anything you&#8217;ve said&#8230;i definitely believe that God&#8217;s plan for marriage is for a man and a woman (for the reasons given above and many more) and that He is revealed and reflected through that. the thing that i don&#8217;t understand though is how a conviction that something is not the will of God has to equal fighting for a legal prohibition. you mentioned the argument of slavery in the bible, but didn&#8217;t say how you respond to that. i&#8217;d be interested to hear your thoughts because that&#8217;s something i hear a lot. the bible doesn&#8217;t say you should go and fight and overturn the institution of slavery, but rather overturns the system from the inside (or at least that&#8217;s how it seems to me) by commanding not only slaves to obey their masters, but also masters to care for and love their slaves. it&#8217;s being an example of God&#8217;s love and kingdom of upside down justice in the midst of an unjust system. so why can&#8217;t it be a similar thing with same sex marriage (or abortion, too, but i guess that&#8217;s a different discussion)? why can&#8217;t we respond to this by first loving people and bringing them to know God rather than condemning? openly advocating against same sex marriage is condemnation of individual people who associate their identities with their sexuality, not just of a certain sin. making same sex marriage illegal isn&#8217;t going to make gay people not gay and gay people aren&#8217;t going to see the example of christ when they are constantly being attacked by christian political movement. but maybe if the church makes an effort to reach out and be the hands and feet of God to this ostracized community, they will come to know Jesus and be transformed from the inside out, perhaps overturning the system in the process. i don&#8217;t think that the role of the government is to propagate christian values or that loving people where they are always means total acceptance of what they do. even just thinking about the homosexual co-op on my college campus- if my christian fellowship started campaigning on campus to make same sex marriage illegal, we would NEVER be able to build relationships with the gay community- barriers would be built up immediately. but by being friends with the individuals who make up that community and being an example of love, maybe they will see Jesus. i&#8217;m not saying we should dumb down the gospel or pretend like God thinks homosexuality and same-sex marriage is great. but couldn&#8217;t it be possible to stand strong on scripture while also finding ways to relate to a community that has been so unfairly ostracized by christians in the past, to speak the truth in love when it comes up in conversations but not create political campaigns around it? to be clear, i&#8217;m not saying that i &#8220;support&#8221; marriage equality, but rather that we should be living and praying for people to know Jesus in a real way instead of politically advocating against same sex marriage. if you&#8217;re advocating open condemnation of same sex marriage, how is that to be done in love? how would you say the knowledge that male/female marriage reflects the image of God affect how the church should approach this issue in the public sphere?</p>
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		<title>By: Vesper</title>
		<link>http://lambofgodnj.org/blogs/esther/states-of-life/same-sex-marriage-sure-why-not/comment-page-1/#comment-304</link>
		<dc:creator>Vesper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Jun 2009 13:27:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lambofgodnj.org/blogs/esther/?p=203#comment-304</guid>
		<description>Yes, Lon--I can especially concur with your point that the absence of one of the parents in the home can mess with the child&#039;s understanding of the same and opposite sexes. I grew up not knowing my biological father (and probably never will), and with a stepfather who did not accept me as his own child. The ramifications of that have been huge in my life.

Similarly, my grandmother made an observation that I have seen play out as true almost every time: that when a boy loses his mother, either through death or divorce or illness, before adulthood (and especially before puberty), it shakes his foundation in a mighty way. She sees this with her own brother, and I see it with mine.

There&#039;s also the very necessary conflict that adolescents have with their same-sex parent that could potentially be lost.

I&#039;ve had several friends whose parents split up (and sadly, it usually occured around their teen years) because one of them came out. We can never overestimate the havoc that wreaks on a pubescent&#039;s sense of self and sexuality.

My point is that ideally, as much as it is in our control, the male-female paradigm is essential for the proper formation of children. And I don&#039;t believe that is something that &quot;society&quot; has made up--it&#039;s part of that revelation thang again. There&#039;s an element of God&#039;s image in us that needs examples of both counterparts to be fully who we are. Again, as much as it depends on us, we ought to seek those out, especially if the hand that was dealt us was *not* that ideal. I thank God that I have had the example of godly men in my life (most notably my grandfather, husband and father-in-law) to show me what the heart of the Father is really like.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, Lon&#8211;I can especially concur with your point that the absence of one of the parents in the home can mess with the child&#8217;s understanding of the same and opposite sexes. I grew up not knowing my biological father (and probably never will), and with a stepfather who did not accept me as his own child. The ramifications of that have been huge in my life.</p>
<p>Similarly, my grandmother made an observation that I have seen play out as true almost every time: that when a boy loses his mother, either through death or divorce or illness, before adulthood (and especially before puberty), it shakes his foundation in a mighty way. She sees this with her own brother, and I see it with mine.</p>
<p>There&#8217;s also the very necessary conflict that adolescents have with their same-sex parent that could potentially be lost.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve had several friends whose parents split up (and sadly, it usually occured around their teen years) because one of them came out. We can never overestimate the havoc that wreaks on a pubescent&#8217;s sense of self and sexuality.</p>
<p>My point is that ideally, as much as it is in our control, the male-female paradigm is essential for the proper formation of children. And I don&#8217;t believe that is something that &#8220;society&#8221; has made up&#8211;it&#8217;s part of that revelation thang again. There&#8217;s an element of God&#8217;s image in us that needs examples of both counterparts to be fully who we are. Again, as much as it depends on us, we ought to seek those out, especially if the hand that was dealt us was *not* that ideal. I thank God that I have had the example of godly men in my life (most notably my grandfather, husband and father-in-law) to show me what the heart of the Father is really like.</p>
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		<title>By: Lon</title>
		<link>http://lambofgodnj.org/blogs/esther/states-of-life/same-sex-marriage-sure-why-not/comment-page-1/#comment-303</link>
		<dc:creator>Lon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Jun 2009 03:47:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lambofgodnj.org/blogs/esther/?p=203#comment-303</guid>
		<description>In addition to which, one of the primary purposes of marriage is the creation of a stable environment in which bring up children.  While the nuclear family (one man, one woman, plus kids) is not the biblical family (think multiple generations living in the same household), the absence of either a mother or a father is profound and will create long-term problems in the ability of the child to relate to others,including God Himself.

But the fundamental issue is, as you state, that marriage is a microcosm of the relationship between God and His People, and it is the fundamental unit of the Church.  Mess with the integrity of those things, and you&#039;re playing around with the integrity of God&#039;s purposes in Creation.

Like you, Vesper, I have many acquaintances and not a few friends who are homosexual and are in long-term committed relationships.  I value my friendships with these folks, but their relationships with their partners, whatever else they may be, are not marriage and never will be marriage, regardless of what laws may be passed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In addition to which, one of the primary purposes of marriage is the creation of a stable environment in which bring up children.  While the nuclear family (one man, one woman, plus kids) is not the biblical family (think multiple generations living in the same household), the absence of either a mother or a father is profound and will create long-term problems in the ability of the child to relate to others,including God Himself.</p>
<p>But the fundamental issue is, as you state, that marriage is a microcosm of the relationship between God and His People, and it is the fundamental unit of the Church.  Mess with the integrity of those things, and you&#8217;re playing around with the integrity of God&#8217;s purposes in Creation.</p>
<p>Like you, Vesper, I have many acquaintances and not a few friends who are homosexual and are in long-term committed relationships.  I value my friendships with these folks, but their relationships with their partners, whatever else they may be, are not marriage and never will be marriage, regardless of what laws may be passed.</p>
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